Fishbowl with Live Blogging
February 15, 2008
8:25-9:24 am MST
February 15, 2008
8:25-9:24 am MST
Dan Maas:
Dan is the Chief Information Officer for Littleton Public Schools as well as a parent of a LPS student.
Cathy Nelson:
Cathy is a teacher librarian from Myrtle Beach, SC. She writes her own personal reflections about technology integration in the classroom at technotuesday.edublogs.org. Her blog is designed to offer helpful hints, tips, and tricks to teachers who are integrating technology in an authentic manner.
Chris Lehmann:
Chris is the Principal of the Science Leadership Academy in Philadelphia, PA. Previously he served as a Technology Coordinator/English Teacher/Girls' Basketball Coach/Ultimate Coach at the Beacon School, a fantastic progressive public high school in Manhattan.
266 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 266 of 266clarao---I do think that this helps. I'll do like math first than English homework (or vice versa) because math doesn't have a lot of writing and English does. If you just sit there and do all this writing, you will get bored. Just like if you sit there and do math and science in a row, with all those formulas, you'll get bored. So yes, I do think this helps.
Aaron, ha, that's true, elementary school boys are into playing army and stuff, but when does play go to the next level? When do they forget that it's just Play and actually become violent?
Sorry--teachers interrupt!
Kristen, that's a good guestion. I guess you could say that school is somewhat of a game or competition. You have to struggle through hard work, and the reward is new knowledge and good grades.
I agree with Mr. Fisch. Sometimes I find myself just doing homework and schoolwork for the grade (which is the reward). Sometimes it seems like it's just about the grade, because a lot of the stuff we learn won't help us in real life, so we're only learning it so we can take a test, get an A, etc.
alyssa-
That is a really good point! Is the level of competition what makes people more dedicated to certain things?
Kristin-
I think that grades are meant as a sort of competition, and that when we do get a bad grade we really want to strive to do better. Also, schools, especially colleges, want to not only have good grades, but also have another activity, like a sport or something. This is also incorporating and encouraging play into the schools.
Alex-
do you think its better then for everyone on the team to be looking out for themselves like in soccor or all work together like in cross country?
Megan- I like your point, but do the students have motivation to do good on CSAP?
Reacting to Mr. Fisches comment, If rewards reduce internal modavation, should we have them?
Liz, I seriously hope that one day we have laptops in all of our classes. It's hard to improve our technological skills in only one class; if we could use laptops in all of our classes, we would be so much more comfortable around computers.
It sounds like there is a balance to be struck. Too much celebration of "most improved" can spoil development, but also using a penalty to crush someone because they struggle are both bad things. So what can we learn from this? How do we strike the balance?
Maddie, At least for me, playing video games and real life are 2 completly opposite things. When I play a video game, like Battlefront, I'm fine with going out and shooting the enemy. But if I were to join the army, at least at this point, I probably couldn't kill someone. The stories about kids who play games and then go out and act the game out by killing people or themselves are the ecceptioin to the rule. Most people won't even think about doing that because a game is just that, a game.
Clara- I think that competition can make people more dedicated to things. I believe that it is more of a competition with myself that drives me to do better.
maddief-
No I don't think it does. Can't you tell the difference between a pixelated thing that is not real and actually physically seeing someone blow up? There is a huge difference. If you saw someone blow up like on the streets, would you be laughing?
Plus a lot of people think that like violence makes them stronger or more impressive. I don't really play so I probably shouldn't be talking but it seems like a mind set, I notice it in all the boys that I baby sit that are from age 7-10.
katherine, chelsea, alyssa, maegan, liz, lia -
ya but some people think that getting good grades are dorky or whatever haha do you think it would be better to reward kids with something more than a letter like giving them money for how good they do.
Experience though will make you better. So don't quit or give up. eventually it will be rewrding, but alos remember that you will continuously sett the standard for your self higher. My teenaged sons once they beat their games, they sell them and get a more challenging game. Something that will challenge them even more.
alyssa-
I agree. The people who are less competitive with what they are doing, probably are less dedicated and don't care about doing as good of a job.
Mr. Mass-
I think that you sometimes need something that is motivational to keep pushing you along. Many people feel that it is nice to be recognized now and then, to see that someone else noticed that you were trying hard and doing your best.
Like they're saying in the inner circle, when someone tells me I did good but I really know that I didn't, I'll know that they're kind of "just saying that" and do I'll try to step it up the next time. This applies to everything: sports, school...
I also hate it when people do that. I feel like they're saying it to make me feel better because even they know that I didn't do that good.
Test comment
some teams- like Newcastle United -just don't have the kind of teamwork a team like Manchester United. I think teams that don't have teamwork could use play into their workouts
Mr. Maas, I definitely think that crushing someone for failing lowers self-esteem. Teachers need to make the student aware of their error and help correct it in an empathetic manner. However, if the student failed through bad behavior, I think that scolding is okay. As for praising a student for good work, teachers shouldn't take someone's test to the front of the room and show off the A+. They should congratulate students individually.
What Ms. Smith is talking about- Why is happiness conditional, and joyfullness unconditional?
Molly- I think some students have the motivation. Those students have the discipline and competitive drive to do better on CSAP to help their school achieve first place out of the other schools.
I think something's wrong with my blogger so this is just a test...
caitlin- I think joyfullness is a state of being but happyness is a short lived joy.
When something makes us feel good--we are drawn to it. Kids play b/c its enjoyable. The dont want to quit. Neither do adults. Babies respond b/c the realize the interaction is enjoyable for you and them.
This is Nile and i just got cut off by Mrs. Smith.
i was just going to say that we are talking so much about getting compliments from coaches when you don't preform at your highest ability. I think getting put down and having your leaders and coaches tell you when you did someting wrong is just as important because it informs you what you need to improve on. And personaly having my coach be disappointed in me for playing bad motivates me to impress my coach and play better.
-Nile
Games cultivate relationships.
Kristen, a lot more students would be willing to get good grades if they were rewarded with something physical, such as cash. Do you think that AHS would ever do that? That would be awesome! :)
to feed into the inner circle - I think humor is important because it creates a not so tense atmospere and i agree with waht nicole said completely because I feel the same way if I feel comportable in the class I speak up and it helps me learn.
megan-
i agree, its like if the school treats you well then you have more motivation to treat it well by doing good on standarized tests
Nile- I agree completely! I was going to make a comment about that but I never got the chance. Same old. haha. It is definately important to have criticism. It motivates me more than being praised does.
I really like twhat Nicole said-
"Play is established through relationships." My math teacher from last year is a good example because he made fun of us and laughed at us and although at first it scared us all, we learned to do the same to him, and he incorporated those relationships to our learning both with other students and himself.
Nile-
I totally agree. When I am doing tumbleing and my instructor tells me that I'm doing something wrong and that he knows I can get it but I'm not trying hard enough, it helps me focus on what I need to do to improve.
molly-
I guess what goes around comes around.I definitely agree with what you are saying.
That would be awesome if we got money for grades!
Humor and good relationships in the classroom are very important. It makes the class more interesting and comfortable.
Molly- Exactly. But then again you always have those students who don't want to do something for their school. I think the students who are like that have incorporated too much play into their lives and not enough work.
I think the more expression and more interesting your teacher is the mroe inspired you become and stuff its like a virus. If your teacher is inspiring and interesting then you start to catch on and feel mroe comfortable in the classroom and you respond better to teachers that way.
I think the more expression and more interesting your teacher is the mroe inspired you become and stuff its like a virus. If your teacher is inspiring and interesting then you start to catch on and feel mroe comfortable in the classroom and you respond better to teachers that way.
Maddie and Kristin-
This is very true. Many kids will get good grades just because they will get money for every A that they get from parents. This does not not really seem like motivation, but almost a bribe.
Teachers DO wonder if you are laughing w/ or at them!
katherinem---If relationships are awkward in class, it won't be comfortable and we won't learn as well. It helps to have a connection and some humor in the class.
Nile/Mark
There is a stereotype that football coaches verbaly abuse their players to get them to do good, but now you are talking about compliments in the team... How are you guys really treated? Is there empathy?
But a teacher can tell when a class "likes" the topic, the work, the content etc.
maddie - I don't know if arapahoe would do that but I could see a private school doing it because they get extra money from the kids going there. but I think anything physical that's a wanted item will make kids try harder
Does play trivialize what we do? I think people have been taught to think that, but does it have to be that way?
To everyone who is talking about grades-
Grades really don't measure intelligence. They measure work ethic and that is pretty much it. Any one can get an A in an average class. (Honors classes and like AP are more challenging but not my point) But since college's can't individually quiz your actual intelligence and comprehension level, grades is all they see. They are sort of just what the school needs to show that the kids are actually learning.
Very interesting conversation on the inner circle.. I think it's true that the students need to try. They have to care about their future before anyone is getting anywhere.
katherine-
I also feel like it's important to be personal with other students and teachers for that good relationship.
Maddie-
I don't think that Arapahoe would ever give out money. Even though that would be really cool. I think that Mr. Booth wants us to find our own motivation, and take the iniative to earn our own games.
@Cathy - the bell rang, we're done.
Thanks.
Does your school do this "High Schools That Work" trend, where a student can retake a test as many times as needed until it is a passing grade?
Wow it was VERY interstng to see that the students have some of the same thoughts and feeligs that I have in regards to violence in games, and the impact of video games on real life. Same arguments you her in the teacher's lounge or teacher table at lunch. The guys certainly seemed more in favor or defensive about games being just that--games. I think these students also understand that games draw us in b/c we do not have to worry about failure or being assessed quite as much-though there is still the peer pressure to perform. Great discussion class!!
About the military video game, I do not know why Pink included that as Play. If he is trying to portray Play at work, the military is unlike any other occupation. The two should not be related, (military and Play or military and work).
More about the video game-I agree with maddie, it is another form of propaganda. I disagree that is right or correct to use it. Video games are much different than posters. People experience video games and become absorbed and obsessed with them. I think this is why we have had so many school shootings. The people become consumed by the idea of killing and as killing being a good and fun thing. If your goal is to earn points to win, earning points is good. If you earn points by killing people, killing is good. There is too much controversy around video games to have the United States Military setting an example and making a Federal stand that video games are a good thing.
Mr. Maas
I believe that celebrating something that someone excels at is a wonderful thing that encourages them to do better, and it should also inspire other people to be like that person. People should congratulate the person who has done well. They should not become jealous or depressed. That is one issue I think we, as human beings, need to overcome.
I agree with you about the punishing of people for not doing well being a negative thing. I believe that everyone is talented at something, and they should have their focus upon that, especially in children. Trying to push them to do well in math, and punishing them if they do not, is very wrong if they do not accomplish math very well. While, if they do well in math, they should be "nudged" in the right direction, and rewards along the way help. Rather than coming to a balance of these things, I believe we need to come to a new understanding of them.
Mr. Maas
I believe that celebrating something that someone excels at is a wonderful thing that encourages them to do better, and it should also inspire other people to be like that person. People should congratulate the person who has done well. They should not become jealous or depressed. That is one issue I think we, as human beings, need to overcome.
I agree with you about the punishing of people for not doing well being a negative thing. I believe that everyone is talented at something, and they should have their focus upon that, especially in children. Trying to push them to do well in math, and punishing them if they do not, is very wrong if they do not accomplish math very well. While, if they do well in math, they should be "nudged" in the right direction, and rewards along the way help. Rather than coming to a balance of these things, I believe we need to come to a new understanding of them.
-chelseas
I entirely agree. Motivation helps, but if your entire focus to get those grades is for the money reward, the reward should not be given. Rewards are to inspire you to do better. If you can accomplish a task without the reward, then it should not be there. At some point, people should realize that they are becoming educated for themselves and not for the money. Also, if people are getting the grades for the money, they most likely are not retaining any information after the exam.
I read an article that stated that in some eastern US schools students are being paid, by the school, at a rate of $8/hour (twice or three times minimum wage) to go to study halls. The schools are also paying the students $ per test and $ per "A". I think this is rediculous. Not only could those tax dollars be used more wisely, but the students are not getting anything out of this (except a fatter wallet) in terms of education. An "A" is not worth anything. It is what that "A" represents.
I was visiting my friend who was in the hospital for bulimia and one of the counselers asked all of the girls in the unit when the last time was that they played and actually had fun. Almost all of them said a year or two ago,(and look where it got them) this made me realize that in order to stay mentally helthy you sometimes need to have fun and enjoy yourself.
I think one of the reasons people hesitate to "play" is that they feel quilty. I always have a really hard time playing because I have five brothers, They all want to do different things then me. For exsample I would want to go to a spa or somthing and they want to go and play soccer (which I love but for the exsample) so I am the one who gives in because i would make others unhappy so i instead choose to be unhappy myself. But then most of the time i enjoy myself watching other people play.
Also if we always play it is like always sleeping you just feel grose. For exsample I dont enjoy track or swimming yet I do them both just to be in shape, and I tend to be happier after doing somthing I don't enjoy but that was hard for me. just an Idea
Ok so my last point. I don't think that play brings happiness. Further more I think play can bring quilt and sorrow. Picture someone who gets up at ten, plays some video games, goes and rides rollercoasters, comes home and watches a movie, goes to the mall, goes and gets her nails done etc. do you think she would enjoy that? Maybe for one day but that is about it. On the conterary I think that doing things you dont enjoy but bring others happines brings you much more joy. For exsample if someone went to africa and made buildings for orphans rather than sat at home seeing what they want to do they would feel much better about themselfs and about others.
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